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this is need to know real talk about the\h
reality of unidentified aerial phenomenon\h\h

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from australia ross coltart\h
from the us bryce zabel

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hello and welcome back dear listener\h
to need to know i'm ross coulthart\h\h

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and my co-host is bryce zabel and ross it's great\h
to be back for a second episode of need to know\h\h

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um we're we're we're coming to people from\h
australia and the united states you're outside\h\h

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of friends continental a trans-continental news\h
organization yeah but a couple of journalists\h\h

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who are uh willing to take a look at this uh\h
this expanding issue right now and try to make\h\h

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some sense out of it and as we told you in our\h
first episode uh basically we've given you a\h\h

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bit of a pre-sea of what's happened this year i\h
don't know about you bryce but i thought it was\h\h

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very important to point out to our viewers and our\h
listeners that it hasn't always been the case that\h\h

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this issue has been subjected to ridicule\h
and stigma and taboo the thing that\h\h

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really leapt out at me when i started looking\h
especially at the historical records in\h\h

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in your defence department and intelligence\h
service archives is that back in around about\h\h

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1947 when this issue first started coming on\h
the radar when people started talking about\h\h

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flying sources there were people in your military\h
your intelligence services and in my government's\h\h

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military and intelligence services and in western\h
and even eastern european countries all over the\h\h

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world the phenomenon was being acknowledged as\h
real uaps weren't a subject for ridicule and\h\h

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giggling mockery they were taken seriously because\h
the government of the day couldn't explain it\h\h

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could they no they could not explain it and i\h
guess taking it seriously uh was shed by degrees\h\h

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but the summer of 1947 it's just a fascinating\h
time to think about in 1947 in the summer\h\h

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three major things happened and there were there\h
are other things besides but the first major thing\h\h

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was uh the the thing that kicked off the\h
flying saucer craze if you will was that a\h\h

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pilot a private pilot in washington state a guy\h
named kenneth arnold saw nine different craft\h\h

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flying in formation quite fast and he came back\h
and told his story and it it really caught on\h\h

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and caught the people's imagination and then uh\h
less than uh a week later about two weeks later\h\h

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or roswell happened um and for i'm not sure\h
everyone remembers exactly how that was treated\h\h

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but it goes straight to your point they put out\h
a press release in roswell saying that they had\h\h

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a flying disc that they'd captured a flying disc\h
and then this is the this is the origin myth of\h\h

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the greatest conspiracy theory of all this is\h
the mystery that won't go away the allegation\h\h

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that the united states government has secretly\h
recovered an alien spacecraft well the third truth\h\h

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yeah well the truth is if that happened and i\h
think that um your book uh has a lot to say about\h\h

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it i've certainly talked and written about it\h
over the years if it happened it isn't uh i think\h\h

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it's the original sin of the ufo cover-up if it\h
happened uh because it really set the template uh\h\h

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where the the whole thing disappeared think about\h
it if it something happened in 1947 that caused\h\h

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the the base at roswell to put out a press release\h
saying that a flying disc they took it back the\h\h

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next day and nobody heard a thing about it until\h
1980. well that's a that's uh 33 years that's a\h\h

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long time to put something under the table and you\h
know the funny thing about it is if you read the\h\h

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gillibrand amendment the amendment of senator\h
gillibrand that's now before the congress it's\h\h

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now talking about retrieving the absolute one of\h
these objects it's talking about testing materials\h\h

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medical studies what would they be studying\h
medically do you think bryce if there was one of\h\h

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these objects recovered i mean there's a there's\h
a bear in the room here isn't there we're talking\h\h

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about craft aren't we it's it's crazy and what has\h
happened over the years uh in in certainly here in\h\h

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america and i think also parallel in australia and\h
and around the world is that at first only a few\h\h

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things could be even talked about and everything\h
else was just too crazy so at first you said well\h\h

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i can maybe think that there are objects out there\h
but oh boy i don't want to talk about the fact\h\h

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there might be people inside them and then it was\h
like well maybe there's people inside them but i\h\h

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certainly don't want to talk about them crashing\h
and recovering crafting bodies and now they do\h\h

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talk about those things and what about abductions\h
same thing yeah it's funny i don't quite know what\h\h

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to think about abductions i don't know what to\h
think about my labs military abductions it just\h\h

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does my hitting but i'm not dismissing anymore the\h
possibility that the united states has recovered\h\h

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alien non-human technology and the reason why is\h
because when i was writing my book i i decided to\h\h

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write a whole lot of letters all over america\h
i thought who are the most interesting people\h\h

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that might know something and one of the guys i\h
wrote to was the guy who was essentially the chief\h\h

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boffin for the u.s navy a guy called nat cobots\h
and i got matt at just the right time he was\h\h

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a beautiful man god bless him i really miss him\h
actually because he was a lovely fellow to talk to\h\h

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very very sharing scientist one of those wonderful\h
brooklyn jewish men with a big sense of humor\h\h

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and he was talking to me at the time that\h
there were the bushfires in australia when we\h\h

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were basically on fire which you wouldn't think\h
now because we're half underwater at the moment\h\h

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but the um the thing he told me after several\h
months of talking was that he was quote read into\h\h

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he was security briefed given the classified\h
briefings that allowed him to be read into\h\h

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a uap crash retrieval program and when he told\h
me that i almost fell off my chair because\h\h

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you know i was saying to him is roswell real and\h
he just chuckled he just said he'd been told about\h\h

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the recovery of multiple craft multiple craft\h
which i think is an astonishing chapter in your\h\h

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book and he's an astonishing witness and there\h
are others uh i i i'll say this though i think\h\h

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people who first hear about such things the first\h
thing that they think in their minds is what these\h\h

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things have come all the way across the universe\h
and they're crashing what's what's up with that\h\h

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and i don't have a great answer for that but i do\h
have an answer um you don't send the individual\h\h

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craft these 30-foot things or whatever they\h
are across the universe you probably send a\h\h

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much larger thing across the universe and then\h
these are the things flying around locally\h\h

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in the same way that we don't send an fa 18 from\h
here to wherever it's supposed to deliver its\h\h

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payload we put it on a giant uh carrier and and\h
and go out into the ocean and cross the ocean and\h\h

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then they fly local missions and sometimes those\h
fa-18s do crash so um i think that's more like the\h\h

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parallel but i i don't know what do you think is\h
that one way to explain well i can tell you one\h\h

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of the things i want to acknowledge here bryce\h
is when i first started researching this subject\h\h

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friends of mine would say to me what what are\h
you working on and i'd go i'm doing a book on\h\h

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i didn't want to admit that i was doing a book\h
on ufos because inevitably the conversation\h\h

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comes round to what so you believe in\h
little green men aliens extraterrestrials\h\h

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visiting this planet and as we discussed\h
in the last show i hope people understand\h\h

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now that what we're talking about is a mystery\h
yes we're acknowledging that there's a mystery\h\h

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and one of the perennial conspiracy theory\h
mysteries that's been bobbing up in the custard\h\h

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ever since the 1940s but particularly since\h
the 1980s when that roswell story really broke\h\h

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is this claim that the united states government\h
has recovered non-human technology now as you and\h\h

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i both know there was an organization that was\h
set up of all people by a guy called tom delong\h\h

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the former lead singer of blink 182 called\h
to the stars academy and it was essentially\h\h

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intended to be a ufo transparency group but one\h
of the things it started talking about very early\h\h

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on was that it had recovered quote meta materials\h
objects that had either fallen off craft or been\h\h

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recovered from these anomalous objects that had\h
been videoed or seen by witnesses and that these\h\h

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materials were being tested and there are some\h
quite extraordinary claims that have been made\h\h

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even about those materials let alone the claims\h
of recovered craft aren't there if there's a\h\h

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journalistic race to break any story right now\h
i think it's crash recovery i think that's the\h\h

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the the thing that is being chased behind the\h
scenes right now and because the threshold of\h\h

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saying that out loud that's the quiet part and if\h
you say it out loud uh that's just a game changer\h\h

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so i think editors across the nation are probably\h
not not eager to do that but when the if there's\h\h

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another big shoe to drop it's going to be that one\h
and the reason it's so frightening to the status\h\h

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quo is that just changes the whole discussion it's\h
like we're having an entirely different world at\h\h

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that point because at that point there's going to\h
be lawsuits filed to get their hands on that we're\h\h

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going to demand reports congress is going to have\h
hearings it's going to be nuts because let me set\h\h

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the scene the thing that fascinated me is as a\h
journalist i'm taught to go back to source so i\h\h

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asked myself the question what has any president\h
said about the allegation that there's been crash\h\h

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recoveries that has been recovered let's talk\h
let's talk candidly about what we're talking about\h\h

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here we're talking about a spacecraft an object\h
a vehicle that has been built by non-human hands\h\h

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not of this earth not of this world that's what\h
we're talking about and i must confess right at\h\h

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the very beginning of my research i thought well\h
this is just rubbish it's just [\h__\h] there's no\h\h

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way anybody's going to have a recovered craft\h
roswell was a tinfoil hat fantasy i'm not so\h\h

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sure anymore not just because of what nat cobits\h
has said but because of what people for example\h\h

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there's a dr eric davis a very well respected\h
astrophysicist who's spoken several times on\h\h

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popular radio shows talking about the fact that\h
he is aware that the united states has recovered\h\h

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craft but he's claiming that they've had a lot of\h
difficulty back engineering those craft i myself\h\h

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have spoken to people who purport to be in the\h
program scientists and officials who've allegedly\h\h

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been read into security briefed into a program\h
where they are allegedly reportedly trying to\h\h

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back engineer craft the problem i have with\h
this is i i just i still can't accept it because\h\h

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i accept this prima facie evidence to support that\h
possibility but the thing i'm wrestling with bryce\h\h

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is the fact that the white house itself put out\h
a press release in 2011 responding to a petition\h\h

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demanding transparency on alleged extraterrestrial\h
visitations to planet earth and they categorically\h\h

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denied that the us government had any knowledge\h
of such extraterrestrial visitations and moreover\h\h

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they categorically denied that there was any\h
recovered spacecraft any recovered vehicle in the\h\h

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position of the united states so frankly someone's\h
lying well there i think i think when we rewrite\h\h

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the history books uh that very statement from 2011\h
is going to be involved in it uh that was more of\h\h

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a first of all that was the obama administration\h
rejecting the possibility that there might\h\h

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might be somebody else out there we might not be\h
alone and it was just a sort of a it was just a\h\h

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casual put down of that idea and yet obama himself\h
has just been on television in 2021 talking about\h\h

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uh that uap report that uh we've been discussing\h
and it's not just obama that's the thing that\h\h

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gets me here is you've had bill clinton drop\h
hints before that he tried to find out about\h\h

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the phenomenon about ufos he he asked people to\h
go and literally knock on the door at area 51\h\h

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the secret nevada test range where a lot of\h
this black technology is allegedly tested\h\h

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and i think he's actually admitted that he had\h
some frustration i've spoken to dan sheehan an\h\h

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attorney who allegedly according to him did some\h
work for jimmy carter and his science advisory\h\h

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team trying to investigate what the u.s government\h
knew back in the 1970s about the phenomenon and\h\h

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and he's claimed that he actually was given access\h
to secret still classified project blue book files\h\h

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which showed photographs of well there's another\h
word for it a flying saucer in the possession of\h\h

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the us government and danny's convinced there's\h
been a cover-up and he's quite a well-respected\h\h

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civil rights attorney and it's not just him you've\h
got um uh hints from people like christopher\h\h

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mellon that he's now no longer so sure he was\h
the former deputy assistant secretary of defense\h\h

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and and he's admitted that he tried to find\h
out if there was this kind of hidden technology\h\h

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was there a secret ufo program was there a\h
an aurora spacecraft that was being built\h\h

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by the united states in secret and he was told\h
categorically denied that such a craft existed\h\h

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now frankly my friend i hope if any country in\h
the world has this technology i hope it's yours\h\h

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because frankly i i fear for the possibilities\h
if it's russia or china the consequences if\h\h

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authoritarian regimes with ill intentions like\h
russia or china get their hands on technology\h\h

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like this is pretty scary so i sincerely hope when\h
people say to me ah look it must be it must be\h\h

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technology that's being developed in the black\h
by the u.s i tell them that that the official\h\h

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policy stated to the congress is that this is not\h
these uaps are not known technology in the arsenal\h\h

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of the united states there's there's not a tr3b\h
they claim jacked up on blocks in a cave in area\h\h

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51. they don't they don't have a spacecraft hidden\h
somewhere they've categorically denied that what i\h\h

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find fascinating is somebody is clearly lying\h
somebody is clearly lying and and if if maybe\h\h

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we've gone from the space race to the crash race\h
and uh that that's been going on behind the scenes\h\h

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for years i think the lack of transparency\h
that the the governments of the world have\h\h

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brought to this over the years is really being\h
felt at this point because it leaves uh people\h\h

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like us respected journalists like yourself who\h
who want to get some facts and and there's just\h\h

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a dearth of them because people won't come\h
forward publicly they come forward privately\h\h

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to you and you're hearing these incredible stories\h
and that may be very well what the story of 2022\h\h

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is as we look forward to the next year what we may\h
be seeing is the outlines of how this thing starts\h\h

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to shake itself down 2021 as we kind of look back\h
in the rear view mirror to 2021 we can see what\h\h

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that was all about that was admitting that the uap\h
phenomena is real not stating exactly who it was\h\h

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but as you as you as the information that you've\h
been getting from people comes forward and others\h\h

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and myself we've all heard these rumors and these\h
discussions for years 2022 may be the year where\h\h

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we start to really really talk about that and and\h
you i i so empathize with what you've been saying\h\h

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where it's just crazy and your friends\h
are like you don't really believe and yet\h\h

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if you do the work and if you start to talk to\h
people you say well i have to believe something\h\h

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and i'll just part with this i've lived for like\h
25 years now where i always say i'm treated like\h\h

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the drunk uncle at the wedding where people go\h
well there's bryce talking about that again and\h\h

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the difference in 2021 is palpable to me i don't\h
get treated like that anymore i get people saying\h\h

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not what's he up to but what can he tell me\h
i get people saying come here buddy tell me\h\h

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what you know i agree i mean it's funny because\h
people friends of mine i'm a member of this group\h\h

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called icij the international consortium of\h
investigative journalists and they've done\h\h

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work on say the pandora papers or the panama\h
papers and running all sorts of collaborative\h\h

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investigative journalism and so there's these\h
fantastic journals all over the world who share\h\h

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investigations and share stories and in the\h
last few months since my book's been published\h\h

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i've been getting these kind of whispered calls\h
where journals ring me and they go hey ross ross\h\h

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i i hear you've written a book on ufos and the the\h
accent i'm trying to do there is a spanish guy and\h\h

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he told me that um he was aware that\h
his government had been investigating a\h\h

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particular ufo incident and he'd been frightened\h
to run the story but because he'd seen my book\h\h

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and heard me being quoted somewhere\h
he was happy to start talking about it\h\h

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and i think there's a groundswell there's just the\h
beginning of an inkling in the mainstream media\h\h

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that this is a story worth reporting and for me i\h
was in the states earlier this year when shortly\h\h

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after the uap task force report the preliminary\h
report on uaps was tabled in the congress you\h\h

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had that extraordinary 60 minutes story yes which\h
even though i don't think it really said that much\h\h

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that was new it was just incredible to see they\h
broke their own taboo i mean all in all the year\h\h

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60 minutes is you know the granddaddy of the news\h
programs here in the united states and they really\h\h

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don't fool around with ufo stories historically\h
so for them to do the uap story even if it was\h\h

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a little tepid they still did it and that that\h
made it uh for my money and i think yours too\h\h

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one of the top ten stories of uh 2021 the fact\h
that they would they would do that and that's why\h\h

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as we look to 2022 i think we have to acknowledge\h
that this is a damn breaking kind of story\h\h

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okay it's possible that if if nobody comes up\h
with that breaking story that it kind of gets\h\h

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put back in the barn but i don't see it that way\h
we've got reports being written now every time a\h\h

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report gets released politicians are going to have\h
to talk about it and when politicians talk about\h\h

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it journalists write about it editors ask their\h
journalists to look look into it for more stories\h\h

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so um i i believe that what we're about to see\h
happen is the competition that developed uh\h\h

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post-watergate or during watergate to break a\h
different story between newspapers uh now it may\h\h

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be between different journalistic uh uh groups but\h
we're gonna see competition come in and break this\h\h

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up bryce we're gonna knock them all off mate this\h
is why need to know is here we're going to be out\h\h

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there ahead of the pack well i like that i like\h
that because in fact ross that's exactly what you\h\h

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did with your book you said and you you're done\h
seriously don't hide your light under a bushel\h\h

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mate i'm a huge fan of your medium columns you\h
know um there's a lot of things you've told me and\h\h

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some of the columns that you write on medium that\h
frankly i never knew anything about i didn't know\h\h

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that john lennon had seen a ufo that he apparently\h
claimed to even met an alien in his bedroom or\h\h

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something they're extraordinary stories there\h
are there are so many extraordinary stories and\h\h

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i think that that's what's so fun about uh being\h
my father was a history teacher all right and um\h\h

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he'd probably be rolling over in his grave right\h
now if he realized some of the things i've done to\h\h

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history but even my father had someone who came\h
to him when dark skies was on the air and said\h\h

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uh hey harvey your son is the guy that's\h
producing that show and uh he said yeah\h\h

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and this friend took my father's side and goes i\h
was sent to roswell um after uh after we went home\h\h

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because they had served together and he said\h
and uh definitely something happened there\h\h

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and your son you tell your son he he said to my\h
father you tell your son to keep on this because\h\h

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we all knew it was a big deal and they just\h
told us to not look and not talk so that kind of\h\h

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stuff's been going down and i think that what that\h
means is there's enough of it that that the the\h\h

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people who want to find the new history stories\h
they're going to fold into history and that's why\h\h

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i like you know lenin and all these other things\h
because they're part of the tapestry of disclosure\h\h

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no i agree with you i'm getting people doing that\h
for me as well i mean i'm even getting people\h\h

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who i've dealt with on other stories not only in\h
your country but in my country people who work in\h\h

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quite senior levels in our defence\h
department or intelligence services\h\h

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and they're saying to me keep on going on\h
this one rosco come on keep on plotting\h\h

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don't be shy keep on going hard don't let\h
the bastards pull the wool over your eyes\h\h

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and it's really interesting because one of the\h
reasons i've come to the conclusion there is\h\h

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really something to this people often\h
ask me why do i so strongly believe\h\h

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that there is a lot more knowledge inside the u.s\h
government in particular that's being concealed\h\h

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and this might sound like a digression but\h
funnily enough the people we have to thank\h\h

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most of all are the most repressive authoritarian\h
nasty bunch of intelligence thugs in the world the\h\h

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russian gru because prior to the 2016 election in\h
your country hillary clinton versus donald trump\h\h

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there was an attempt no back off all the\h
conspiracy theorists this part's true\h\h

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there was definitely an attempt by russia\h
to try and help donald trump through social\h\h

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media and one of the things the gru did\h
and this is the subject of a criminal\h\h

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deposition that's been certified by the fbi and\h
by i think a state attorney a federal attorney\h\h

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is that there were agents of the gru the russian\h
intelligence service military intelligence hacking\h\h

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the democratic national committee that's the dnc\h
the democrats and they broke into the email system\h\h

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of a guy called john podesta now this may be\h
an elaborate in the telling but stick with me\h\h

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here because this really matters this is to me\h
one of the smoking guns in this whole scene and\h\h

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this is how journalism works you're about\h
tell the story that's how journalism works\h\h

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john podesta was a former senior policy advisor\h
to both bill clinton and also to barack obama\h\h

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hugely respected guy in the beltway knows a lot\h
of people very very well connected he's worked for\h\h

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different white houses over many many years he was\h
becoming part of the hillary clinton campaign team\h\h

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and what we now know is that hillary clinton\h
for years with bill had been meeting lawrence\h\h

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rockefeller they'd been aware of rockefeller's\h
interest and passion about opening up the secrets\h\h

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of ufos uaps and so clinton was hardwired into\h
exposing what could be exposed that's still secret\h\h

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inside the us government and in these emails that\h
the gru leaked they show that john podesta was in\h\h

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email communication with general michael carey\h
from space command norad general neil mccaslin\h\h

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from the foreign technology division\h
of the wright-patterson air force base\h\h

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robert weiss of lockheed martin and of all\h
people tom de long the punk rock rock singer of\h\h

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blink 182 the punk rock band they were secretly\h
talking about disclosure about hillary clinton\h\h

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making an announcement and if you look at those\h
emails that are incontrovertibly authentic they\h\h

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are real absolutely they show that prior to the\h
2016 election there was a policy underway under\h\h

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consideration by hillary clinton to make some kind\h
of a disclosure about uaps to the american public\h\h

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now to this day my friend i just don't get\h
it i don't know why every news hound in the\h\h

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country it's isn't beating down the door of\h
hillary clinton what the hell was going on\h\h

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that's why we need to know what need to know\h
is going to do about this because we're going\h\h

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to have to do that ourselves when people won't\h
do it i'll tell you something when john podesta\h\h

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left office uh after uh the loss in 2016 um he put\h
out a tweet that said his greatest regret was not\h\h

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achieving ufo disclosure and at first people went\h
that's crazy what is he talking about and he never\h\h

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backed down from it and it was a serious tweet\h
it wasn't him uh making something up tell you a\h\h

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quick clinton story um i know of a woman who was\h
on a on a flight uh after clinton left office and\h\h

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clinton was on the plane it was a private plane\h
in the middle of the night he wasn't sleeping\h\h

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and um he told this she was the uh uh what do\h
you flight attendant she was the flight attendant\h\h

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and he said he's just killing time he goes ask me\h
anything you know just talk to me you know what do\h\h

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you want to know just ask me i'll tell you and and\h
she said uh well what about ufos and he got a look\h\h

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on his face and he goes i wish you hadn't asked\h
me that one that's the one i can't tell you about

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i and and you know the truth of the matter is like\h
again it's one thing to be skeptical and say i\h\h

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don't know whether to believe or not believe this\h
but you can at least say certain things happen\h\h

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clearly the clintons have talked about ufos\h
clearly the clintons have been interested\h\h

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in the topic for years and the question uh think\h
about how we might have been diverted had clinton\h\h

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won instead of trump in in 2016. we might be\h
having a very different conversation right now if\h\h

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if indeed she was willing to take that leap and\h
start talking about this as the president and then\h\h

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you have to ask yourself if it's that good a topic\h
and presidents can talk about it where was trump\h\h

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during this where's biden during this why are they\h
still not doing this okay but that's the other\h\h

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thing too this is the other thing that infuriates\h
me about the white house press corps because have\h\h

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you noticed any time the the subject of ufos uaps\h
gets raised in the white house or in the pentagon\h\h

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there's always this kind of nervous titter like\h
a bunch of nervous school kids it's horrible\h\h

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it's horrible just pathetic they're failing the\h
american public let me tell you what my i'm sorry\h\h

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but my number one pet peeve on this thing is we\h
had an election in 2016 and an election in 2020\h\h

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where this topic is on people's minds and it's\h
a serious topic or we wouldn't be writing uh\h\h

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government reports about it in all of the debates\h
in 2020 there was not a question asked about ufos\h\h

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or uap there were questions about all manner of\h
other things and not one now if it's a real issue\h\h

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why are we not talking about it so i will make one\h
prediction uh looking forward i believe in 2024\h\h

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it's impossible for this to be a completely\h
ignored issue it will come right yeah no i\h\h

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agree and i i it's like it's one of those one of\h
the things you'd know about bryce there's a thing\h\h

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in journalism you have sleeper stories stories\h
that you just know are major stories but they're\h\h

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not getting on the front page yeah this is it for\h
me this is it this is why we're doing neat tonight\h\h

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yes because people need to know about this i i\h
get so frustrated by the fact that you know at\h\h

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any briefing when people are asked questions\h
about ufos there's always that pathetic titter\h\h

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and yet you've got things like say for example the\h
former cia director john brennan he dropped the\h\h

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biggest hint in december last year wow i think\h
some of the phenomena we're going to be seeing\h\h

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continues to be unexplained and might in fact be\h
some type of phenomenon that is not that is the\h\h

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result of something that we don't yet understand\h
and quote that could involve some type of activity\h\h

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that some might say constitutes a different form\h
of life yes sir that's a former cia unbelievable\h\h

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and and and and remember uh the first cia director\h
roscoe hillenkotter in 1960 wrote the new york\h\h

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times and said uh that this was a real thing and\h
that uh and that people were being directed not\h\h

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to talk about it in the government um so by the\h
way the john brennan thing and the intel people\h\h

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speaking out uh uh john ratcliffe who was the odni\h
under trump spoke out uh i put that as one of the\h\h

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top ten stories of 2021 but another one i agree\h
would be bill nelson from nasa because bill nelson\h\h

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for years and years and years nasa has always\h
taken kind of a hands-off approach we don't\h\h

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really talk about this it's nothing that uh\h
we're too busy doing nasa stuff we're not really\h\h

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going to engage with that and bill nelson the\h
new guy the former senator from uh florida and uh\h\h

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now the and an astronaut a space shuttle astronaut\h
is now running nasa and he is saying the quiet\h\h

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part out loud he is saying there's billions\h
and billions of places that these uap could be\h\h

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explained from and they might just not be us and\h
i love the way he said it he did it with the tease\h\h

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he said no there are even theories that there\h
might be other universes and if that's the case\h\h

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who am i to say planet earth is the only\h
location of a life form that is civilized\h\h

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and organized like ours amazing stuff but\h
then you know but what was cool was it at\h\h

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the same event which was at the um washington\h
right national cathedral back in early november\h\h

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you had the chief spy master for the united\h
states a woman called avril haynes she's the\h\h

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director of national intelligence she oversees all\h
16 u.s spy agencies including the fbi and the cia\h\h

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and she was at this event called the\h
future in space event at the washington\h\h

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cathedral and yet again this happens and it\h
just gets ignored but this is what she said\h\h

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she admitted quote the main issues that congress\h
and others have been concerned about is safety\h\h

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of flight concerns and counter-intelligence\h
issues always there's also the question of\h\h

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is there something else that we simply do not\h
understand which might come extra terrestrially\h\h

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oh she you she used to be and and just to to\h
remind uh our people who are listening right now\h\h

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she's the person who ran the office of the office\h
of the director of national intelligence she is\h\h

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the dni and they were the ones that wrote the\h
june 25th preliminary report on uap that congress\h\h

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demanded so she knows and by the way when you talk\h
about her and you talk about bill nelson for bill\h\h

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nelson to say what he said i mean he's had the\h
big briefing you know you and i have to go out and\h\h

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and and try to dig through stuff and find\h
things the the hard way uh the journalistic way\h\h

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those people have gotten briefings and\h
and they've come out of those briefings\h\h

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and they've been more and more open in their\h
comments in 2021 than ever before in history\h\h

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period i also follow up avril\h
haynes's comments because\h\h

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one of my favorite characters in this is is\h
a guy called lou elizondo who's this guy who\h\h

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looks like a he looks like a marine from central\h
casting you know he's this nuggety soldier spook\h\h

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and he he's got this big bushy beard lovely bloke\h
and um he followed up within a week or two of\h\h

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avril haynes comments he did an interview with\h
british gq magazine the men's fashion magazine\h\h

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and they just asked am i right they said\h
do you believe we have recovered a craft\h\h

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and he's such a flirt amazon he's totally so\h
nicely he says i've been told i have to be very\h\h

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careful how i answer this question i'm not allowed\h
to expound upon anything i've already said what i\h\h

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have said is that it is my opinion my belief a\h
strong belief hint hint that the u.s government\h\h

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is in possession of exotic material associated\h
with uaps that's all i'm allowed to say i mean

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let's pack up and go home okay i'm\h
sorry what part of that was so unclear\h\h

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i i i don't get it and i gotta say i do love uh\h
lou elizondo um i know he's a controversial person\h\h

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and and certainly as we look back in that rearview\h
mirror again we see lou being controversial among\h\h

327
00:35:03,360 --> 00:35:12,880
people who follow the ufo topic but he seems very\h
authentic to me um i'm i'm uh sold on on him and i\h\h

328
00:35:12,880 --> 00:35:20,240
i have to say uh the the straightforwardness that\h
the guy has brought and yet at the same time he's\h\h

329
00:35:20,240 --> 00:35:27,280
the master he's become the zen master of the nda\h
uh statement where he goes well i can't violate my\h\h

330
00:35:27,280 --> 00:35:33,120
nda but i will say and he says a lot by saying\h
a little and it's important well he actually\h\h

331
00:35:33,120 --> 00:35:38,240
went a little bit with gq because they then asked\h
him after they'd asked about spacecraft they said\h\h

332
00:35:38,880 --> 00:35:44,960
do you believe organic matter\h
or beings have been recovered\h\h

333
00:35:45,840 --> 00:35:51,760
and he pauses and he goes i'm respectfully going\h
to have to pass on that questions there's a\h\h

334
00:35:51,760 --> 00:35:58,160
couple of questions i'm really not at liberty to\h
discuss that's one of them they're intelligently\h\h

335
00:35:58,160 --> 00:36:06,320
controlled for sure because they're responding\h
and reacting to our actions that is for certain\h\h

336
00:36:06,880 --> 00:36:14,320
they are absolutely intelligently controlled\h
by something now that's from the head\h\h

337
00:36:15,040 --> 00:36:21,360
of the intelligence that was run out of the\h
office of the director of national intelligence\h\h

338
00:36:21,360 --> 00:36:27,600
avril haynes is the boss of that agency he was\h
the guy who was doing the ufo investigations\h\h

339
00:36:27,600 --> 00:36:33,360
with a security clearance as long as you're in\h
my arm he's been allowed to look in the dark\h\h

340
00:36:33,360 --> 00:36:39,760
crevices inside the u.s intelligence establishment\h
yes he has and what just does my head in and i i\h\h

341
00:36:39,760 --> 00:36:44,400
don't know what's going on here because i know\h
a lot of the good journalists in washington\h\h

342
00:36:44,400 --> 00:36:48,880
i've worked with them i've done collaborations\h
with the washington post and the new york times\h\h

343
00:36:49,680 --> 00:36:54,000
and i know the new york times has broken a\h
couple of stories on this but nobody's like\h\h

344
00:36:54,000 --> 00:37:00,080
this on a dog on a bone it's it's crazy well\h
you are and and and no but we've got to be it's\h\h

345
00:37:00,080 --> 00:37:05,200
we've we've got a story it's you know what there's\h
certain stories this is clearly one of them where\h\h

346
00:37:06,080 --> 00:37:11,200
i've written books or movies before because i\h
wanted to read them and nobody had written them\h\h

347
00:37:11,200 --> 00:37:15,920
so i said well i better write it myself\h
and i think that's this is the journalistic\h\h

348
00:37:15,920 --> 00:37:21,440
uh equivalent of that um we are we're doing it\h
because no one else is and that but they were\h\h

349
00:37:21,440 --> 00:37:25,760
being joined by many people who are thinking\h
about it right now i will say one more thing\h\h

350
00:37:25,760 --> 00:37:33,680
about elizondo he also said if i'm not mistaken in\h
one of his interviews uh that there are photos or\h\h

351
00:37:33,680 --> 00:37:40,480
films or something that show the the\h
word is quote occupancy well yeah\h\h

352
00:37:40,480 --> 00:37:46,960
that's kind of a game over too so yeah if somebody\h
is seeing those kind of that kind of evidence\h\h

353
00:37:46,960 --> 00:37:51,760
uh that pretty well puts us in a new world doesn't\h
it because okay let's let's work through this\h\h

354
00:37:51,760 --> 00:37:54,560
price because we'd better start thinking\h
about wrapping up sir yeah we're actually\h\h

355
00:37:54,560 --> 00:37:59,760
um i hate to do that um but yeah i say do i i hope\h
you're all enjoying it back home we'll have to do\h\h

356
00:37:59,760 --> 00:38:04,160
a lot of these or we'll never get through we've\h
got too many things i've got a thousand things\h\h

357
00:38:04,160 --> 00:38:09,920
i've not said and i know that you have as many and\h
and that's what's going to be fun about this but\h\h

358
00:38:09,920 --> 00:38:15,280
the the cool thing about all of this is that what\h
what is i mean for as journals i try and always\h\h

359
00:38:15,280 --> 00:38:21,920
go back to the absolute nuts and bolts what do we\h
know for sure we know for sure that according to\h\h

360
00:38:22,480 --> 00:38:32,240
numerous informed insiders there are intelligently\h
controlled vehicles craft manufactured objects\h\h

361
00:38:32,960 --> 00:38:41,280
which may or may not have occupants which are\h
doing things far beyond known terrestrial human\h\h

362
00:38:41,280 --> 00:38:48,480
earth-based science we're told officially\h
in a report to congress that this\h\h

363
00:38:48,480 --> 00:38:55,920
is not american technology that it's almost\h
definitely not russian or chinese technology\h\h

364
00:38:57,680 --> 00:39:02,560
if it's not that price unless it's some\h
thunderbirds organization on an island in\h\h

365
00:39:02,560 --> 00:39:09,760
the south pacific who the hell is it you\h
know i i say uh if if the three parts of\h\h

366
00:39:09,760 --> 00:39:15,120
the report were um they're not are i mean\h
that they're real um and the second part is\h\h

367
00:39:15,120 --> 00:39:20,000
we don't make them and the third part is we don't\h
think china or russia makes them either i always\h\h

368
00:39:20,000 --> 00:39:25,680
say do the math what what what's left and i'm not\h
saying it's alien either i don't know what it is\h\h

369
00:39:25,680 --> 00:39:31,040
but if you do the math on that something very\h
odd is is at work in this country and that's\h\h

370
00:39:31,040 --> 00:39:37,040
what drives this this project that we're on right\h
now because this is potentially the most important\h\h

371
00:39:37,040 --> 00:39:43,440
time in human history this may be the the\h
inflection point for a change in how we see the\h\h

372
00:39:43,440 --> 00:39:51,440
world how we see the universe how we see our place\h
how we see ourselves um and and we have problems\h\h

373
00:39:51,440 --> 00:39:56,720
right now in this world i don't think anybody\h
denies that we can't get along with ourselves\h\h

374
00:39:56,720 --> 00:40:02,080
uh we've we've done terrible damage to the\h
place that we live the earth and we have to\h\h

375
00:40:02,080 --> 00:40:05,840
get our act together and everyone knows\h
this i don't think anybody disputes that\h\h

376
00:40:06,400 --> 00:40:12,160
maybe a first step in getting our act together\h
would be to elevate the truth about something\h\h

377
00:40:12,160 --> 00:40:18,720
as profound as this and get it out there and then\h
get to work at being human and fixing our problems\h\h

378
00:40:19,760 --> 00:40:26,720
you know what i wrestle with i wrestle with the\h
why the why the secrecy because i'm now at the\h\h

379
00:40:26,720 --> 00:40:31,440
stage where i don't doubt for a moment that\h
this is real i don't doubt for a moment that\h\h

380
00:40:31,440 --> 00:40:36,560
the united states government knows a huge amount\h
more than it's letting on i mean for example i was\h\h

381
00:40:36,560 --> 00:40:40,640
just laughing to myself this morning because\h
in preparing for this interview i was reading\h\h

382
00:40:40,640 --> 00:40:48,240
the ex-cia director james woolsey's comments to\h
uh friend john greenwald from the black vault site\h\h

383
00:40:48,240 --> 00:40:56,160
earlier in april this year and he described an\h
incident in which a friend of his had his aircraft\h\h

384
00:40:56,160 --> 00:41:05,920
quote stop at 40 000 feet and not continue\h
operating as a normal aircraft right and he\h\h

385
00:41:05,920 --> 00:41:14,400
acknowledged that in the context of uaps now\h
in my country if if if any public servant let\h\h

386
00:41:14,400 --> 00:41:18,480
alone the head of an intelligence service or a\h
former head of an intelligence service came up\h\h

387
00:41:19,040 --> 00:41:24,720
and said this had happened i would be the\h
national correspondent or the national\h\h

388
00:41:24,720 --> 00:41:29,280
security correspondent for the top newspaper and\h
i would say can you please explain what you mean\h\h

389
00:41:30,800 --> 00:41:36,720
where is the curiosity on this i just want\h
this is what gets me i don't understand why\h\h

390
00:41:36,720 --> 00:41:45,440
mainstream media is not rattling the cage on this\h
because the clues are there they are there um and\h\h

391
00:41:45,440 --> 00:41:50,320
i think that if we're lucky uh media\h
will start rattling the cage more i\h\h

392
00:41:50,320 --> 00:41:55,600
just want to because i know that time is\h
is dwindling here you ask the question why\h\h

393
00:41:56,960 --> 00:42:02,720
why why has there been this truth embargo on this\h
topic over these years and i've given a lot of\h\h

394
00:42:02,720 --> 00:42:07,760
thought about that i think about these things\h
i'm laying in bed at night you know saying what\h\h

395
00:42:07,760 --> 00:42:13,920
why okay i have two possibilities that i'll\h
leave you with possibility number one is it's\h\h

396
00:42:13,920 --> 00:42:22,080
scary it's just not fun to consider and that's\h
possible because of the nuclear connection we've\h\h

397
00:42:22,080 --> 00:42:28,080
got and things like it might be scary and the\h
second one is it's just impossible to understand\h\h

398
00:42:28,080 --> 00:42:35,520
i mean it it may be just too strange um i've often\h
loved the the there's a quote from a physicist\h\h

399
00:42:35,520 --> 00:42:41,440
uh haldane at the turn of the century who said\h
the universe made is is not only stranger than we\h\h

400
00:42:41,440 --> 00:42:46,880
imagine it may be stranger than we can imagine\h
now if that's the case that would explain it\h\h

401
00:42:46,880 --> 00:42:53,200
also well the enigmatic lewis elizondo the\h
former head of the pentagon ufo program\h\h

402
00:42:53,200 --> 00:42:59,920
when he was asked about this he said that the\h
real explanation would make people somber yes\h\h

403
00:43:00,800 --> 00:43:05,360
okay that's a perfect setup i'm gonna i\h
have a way to close this out all right i\h\h

404
00:43:05,360 --> 00:43:09,440
used to be the chairman of the television\h
academy i was the guy in charge after 9\h\h

405
00:43:11,280 --> 00:43:17,840
you 11. the emmys i did and we were uh\h
concerned about how we should deal with\h\h

406
00:43:17,840 --> 00:43:22,880
uh having actors walk down the red carpet\h
right and how would we find the right tone\h\h

407
00:43:22,880 --> 00:43:29,840
and gregory peck uh was there right before he\h
died uh at a an event that we were honoring him\h\h

408
00:43:29,840 --> 00:43:36,720
at and i was i mean you got to meet i did i got\h
to introduce him and i talked to him before that\h\h

409
00:43:36,720 --> 00:43:43,360
and i said mr peck um you know a lot of actors\h
are very concerned about how to deal with uh\h\h

410
00:43:43,360 --> 00:43:47,760
you know being appropriate and how do we deal\h
with all this and i'm only saying this because\h\h

411
00:43:47,760 --> 00:43:53,920
you used the word um that you used i said\h
what are your thoughts without missing a\h\h

412
00:43:53,920 --> 00:44:04,320
beat gregory peck looks at me and he says i would\h
be sober but not somber with a twinkle in my eye\h\h

413
00:44:04,320 --> 00:44:11,520
to assure the people that everything was going\h
to be okay now if there's a way out of this\h\h

414
00:44:12,160 --> 00:44:19,920
mystery and whatever i think gregory peck has\h
given a way to think about that it is time to\h\h

415
00:44:19,920 --> 00:44:26,000
be sober it's clearly a time to be sober but\h
we don't have the information yet to be somber\h\h

416
00:44:26,000 --> 00:44:31,680
and we still have to be human we still have to\h
have the twinkle in our eyes and we still have to\h\h

417
00:44:31,680 --> 00:44:37,040
to tell each other it's going to be okay whatever\h
it is and so that's where i come down to this\h\h

418
00:44:37,920 --> 00:44:43,680
well i'll end it by saying bryce we can\h
handle the truth we can i really think\h\h

419
00:44:44,320 --> 00:44:52,000
i think we can and so dear listener i'm sorry\h
to say it's time to go but we'll be back\h\h